Climate change - politics and activism

Applying the Dharma for the preservation of planet Earth and its inhabitants
User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:59 am

SethRich wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:26 am
Greetings Kim,

Without wanting to answer on behalf of perkele, it may very well be the case that there are legitimate concerns that the so-called climate "chaos" being predicted is just fear-mongering designed to usher in a new era of global socialism - a trojan horse if you will. If you take the following sentence for example, most of this is just open borders globalism and (economic and cultural) Marxism in drag.
...
If a group of people are desperate to impose a "solution" on we the people, then we the people first need to be sold on the "problem". Yet, people are becoming increasingly suspicious about what they're shovelling... indeed, some might regard it as "nonsensical bullshit", especially as it deviates further from peer-reviewed science and strays into left-wing political propaganda.

As such, if someone wishes to be a climate advocate, they would be better advised to say things a climatologist would agree with, rather than spout authoritarian dogma that George Soros and Mao Tse Tung might rejoice in (e.g. Green New Deal).

Kind regards.

:candle:
Hi, Retro,
I went through this with a highlighter tagging slurs in blue, logical fallacies in yellow and factual errors in orange but it was then so colourful (mostly blue, I have to say) that it was almost impossible to read, so let's move on: this is a Buddhist forum so I ask you to assess each of the actions which Franzen recommends according to their agreement with the dhamma.
Remember, this has nothing to do with politics (for now) and nothing to do with climate change. These are just things we could do. Are they good things to do, or bad things - kusala or akusala?

• Preparing for fires and floods and refugees ...
• maintain functioning democracies, functioning legal systems, functioning communities.
• Securing fair elections
• Combatting extreme wealth inequality
• Shutting down the hate machines on social media
• Instituting humane immigration policy,
• advocating for racial and gender equality,
• promoting respect for laws and their enforcement,
• supporting a free and independent press,
• ridding the country of assault weapons

Personally, I think they are all good ideas - so if you agree with any of them, I won't mind if you don't back up your agreement with scripture. But if you disagree, please do supply references supporting your view.

:thanks:
Kim

User avatar
SethRich
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by SethRich » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:14 am

Greetings,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:59 am
this is a Buddhist forum so I ask you to assess each of the actions which Franzen recommends according to their agreement with the dhamma.
Given what those recommendations are, this all seems highly irrelevant to a topic on "Climate change - politics and activism"...

:focus:

Kind regards.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:47 am

SethRich wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:14 am
Greetings,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:59 am
this is a Buddhist forum so I ask you to assess each of the actions which Franzen recommends according to their agreement with the dhamma.
Given what those recommendations are, this all seems highly irrelevant to a topic on "Climate change - politics and activism"...

:focus:

Kind regards.

:candle:
Don't wimp out. We are on topic, as you would know perfectly well if you had read even the article extract I quoted, let alone the whole thing (and if you didn't, you have no right to an opinion).

:jedi:
Kim

User avatar
lyndon taylor
Posts: 180
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:30 pm
Location: US occupied Northern Mexico

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by lyndon taylor » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:39 pm

Its a pity when you have to sacrifice Buddhist ideals to feed a right wing political agenda!!
18 years ago I made one of the most important decisions of my life and entered a local Cambodian Buddhist Temple as a temple boy and, for only 3 weeks, an actual Therevada Buddhist monk.

http://trickleupeconomictheory.blogspot.com/

User avatar
SethRich
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by SethRich » Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:20 pm

Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:47 am
Don't wimp out.
Image
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:47 am
We are on topic
What you are proposing to discuss is not on topic, because it has even less to do with the climate than the New Yorker article you are fawning over.

The topic is "Climate change - politics and activism". The sub-forum is "Environmental Dharma".

If climate change is the existential crisis that we are led to believe it is, then using it as a Trojan Horse to smuggle in irrelevant global socialist policies serves only to dilute, discredit and weaken the perception of that threat. If this really is about the environment, then I'm surprised there aren't other environmentalists expressing concerns that it is being subsumed into a political agenda, and being discredited on that basis.

On the other hand, if climate change really is a scare campaign designed to usher in a new world order, it doesn't say much for the record of socialism that the only way it can be imposed is via contrived catastrophes, propaganda and contrived division.

Either way... are there any Green activists left, or have they all turned Watermelon (i.e. Green on the outside, Red on the inside)?

:shrug:

Kind regards.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:49 pm

SethRich wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:20 pm
Greetings Kim,

The topic is "Climate change - politics and activism". The sub-forum is "Environmental Dharma".
...and you are refusing to discuss an article about climate change with respect to the dharma.

:coffee:
Kim

User avatar
SethRich
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by SethRich » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:02 pm

Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:49 pm
...and you are refusing to discuss an article about climate change with respect to the dharma.
The article has already been discussed and assessed by various participants as being "nonsensical bullshit" and "Marxism in drag".

I sympathize that you've struggled to find someone as enthusiastic about such things as you are.

All the best.

Kind regards.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:23 pm

SethRich wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:02 pm
Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:49 pm
...and you are refusing to discuss an article about climate change with respect to the dharma.
The article has already been discussed and assessed by various participants as being "nonsensical bullshit" and "Marxism in drag".

I sympathize that you've struggled to find someone as enthusiastic about such things as you are.

All the best.

Kind regards.

:candle:
Sigh.
Both you and Perkele have been rude about it (and you have been rude about me), but that's all. Simply being rude about something does not count as either discussing or assessing - not in any civilised space, at least. Neither does attempting to drag the discussion into politics, as you have repeatedly done.

If you don't want to discuss the article, why are you here?

:namaste:
Kim

User avatar
Charbel
Posts: 48
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:14 am

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Charbel » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:19 am

Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:59 am
All-out war on climate change made sense only as long as it was winnable. Once you accept that we’ve lost it, other kinds of action take on greater meaning. Preparing for fires and floods and refugees is a directly pertinent example. But the impending catastrophe heightens the urgency of almost any world-improving action. In times of increasing chaos, people seek protection in tribalism and armed force, rather than in the rule of law, and our best defense against this kind of dystopia is to maintain functioning democracies, functioning legal systems, functioning communities.
My immediate response is the above sounds ridiculous to me because, if climate change is true, it is the so-called "functioning democracies, functioning legal systems" that caused the climate problem and have been ineffectual in resolving the problem.

Also, the idea there are "functioning communities" sounds like another non-sense. "Community" is something the Cultural Marxist assault of individualism & minorities priorities has resulted in an individualist society without much community, even without much tribalism, that can serve as resistance to the Big Government of the Capitalist-Marxists, aka, New World Order Global Government. Possibly the only nations that could be called "tribal" are Japan, Israel, Syria-trying-to-survive, Iran and other similar proto-Fascist states.
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:59 am
In this respect, any movement toward a more just and civil society can now be considered a meaningful climate action.
I think John Lennon's "Imagine" dream ended a while ago.
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:59 am
Securing fair elections is a climate action.
:rofl: :crazy:
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:59 am
Combatting extreme wealth inequality is a climate action.
While I do not favour extreme wealth inequality, i imagine extreme wealth inequality favours stopping so-called climate change rather than prevents it. The economic problem of extreme wealth inequality is the wealthy horde rather than spend much of their unproductive wealth. If there was more wealth equality, the masses would buy more polluting consumer junk, like more motor cars.

Climate change is actually a powerful ideology to prevent the polluting CO2 economic development of the undeveloped world, such as Africa. The article again sounds illogical. :crazy:
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:59 am
Shutting down the hate machines on social media is a climate action. Instituting humane immigration policy, advocating for racial and gender equality, promoting respect for laws and their enforcement, supporting a free and independent press, ridding the country of assault weapons—these are all meaningful climate actions. To survive rising temperatures, every system, whether of the natural world or of the human world, will need to be as strong and healthy as we can make it.
The above is the most ridiculous. Immigrating poor people to the USA so they can buy more oil guzzling motor cars. :crazy: The above shows how Climate Change is used as a Political Weapon.

:guns: :toilet:

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:07 pm

In other news ...
Amazon Employees Will Walk Out Over the Company's Climate Change Inaction

...Over 900 Amazon employees have signed an internal petition pledging to walk out over their employer’s lack of action on climate change. The demonstration, scheduled to start at 11:30 am Pacific time on September 20, will mark the first time in Amazon’s 25-year history that workers at its Seattle headquarters have walked off the job, though many are taking paid vacation to do so. Most of the workers who have signed on so far work in Seattle, but employees in other offices, including in Europe, have indicated an interest in the event as well. The protest is part of a global general strike led by 16-year-old climate change activist Greta Thunberg taking place ahead of the United Nations Climate Action Summit on September 23.

WIRED spoke with three Amazon employees who signed the petition and plan to join the walkout. ... "I have a chance here to influence Amazon to become a climate leader, and I think that’s the biggest impact that I personally can bring to the fight," says Maren Costa, a principal UX designer who has worked at Amazon for over 15 years.
https://www.wired.com/story/amazon-walk ... te-change/

:thumb:
Kim

User avatar
SethRich
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by SethRich » Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:52 pm

Greetings,
The demonstration, scheduled to start at 11:30 am Pacific time on September 20, will mark the first time in Amazon’s 25-year history that workers at its Seattle headquarters have walked off the job, though many are taking paid vacation to do so.
So a small percentage at people at Amazon's head office are synchronizing a day of annual leave to save the world? OK...

:rofl:

What they've not really considered is that organizations actually want their people to utilize their annual leave, for a raft of reasons including personal well-being and to reduce the overall liabilities (i.e. owings) of the company. Maybe next year Amazon will organize the protest themselves in order to trim their staff's annual leave balances? 8-)
The protest is part of a global general strike led by 16-year-old climate change activist Greta Thunberg taking place ahead of the United Nations Climate Action Summit on September 23.
:rofl:

I won't criticize Greta directly, because it's the puppet-master who controls the puppet, but the hypocrisy of these UN-orchestrated stunts that they are roping her into are everything that is wrong with Watermelon activism (i.e. Green on the outside, Red on the inside).
The Enormous Carbon Footprint of Sailing to America (link)

In her latest stunt designed to grip the hearts, if not the minds, of the indoctrinated, the young climate activist arrived in New York last week aboard a wind and solar-powered boat rather than a plane to emphasize the need to reduce carbon-emission damage to the planet.

But in the fine tradition of Al Gore, The Aspen Institute, Michelle Obama, and many others who preach “Do as we say, not as we do,” upon disembarking from her Atlantic stunt, Greta’s “helpers” in Sweden themselves boarded jets to carry them to New York in order to retrieve the girl’s boat.

In an August 29 article in The Daily Wire, Ms. Ashe Schow reported:
“Greta Thunberg, the 16-year-old climate activist, arrived in New York City on Wednesday after sailing across the Atlantic on a yacht with solar panels and wind turbines. Forget the fact that carbon is emitted during the construction of the yacht and solar panels. CBS News reported the yacht ‘had no kitchen, no heating, no fridge and no bathroom.’ Thunberg took the yacht to raise awareness about the harmful emissions caused by taking commercial airlines.”

“But even though Thunberg and her crew sailed across the Atlantic using the yacht, it still has to get back. For that, the sailing team for the yacht, known as the “Malizia II” will be flown across the Atlantic to retrieve the vessel. The Associated Press reported that two members of Team Malizia will be flown to the U.S. to retrieve the boat and will pay to offset the flight’s carbon emissions.”
Greta Thunberg Sailed To New York To Avoid Contributing To Climate Change. There’s Just One Problem. According to Schow, the Associated Press reported,
“A spokeswoman for Team Malizia said it’ll be necessary to fly the crew to the U.S. because the high-profile trip with the 16-year-old Swedish campaigner that left Plymouth on Wednesday was arranged at very short notice. Four flights would also have been incurred if Swedish climate activist Thunberg and her father had flown from Europe to the special climate summit in New York and back instead of sailing with the racing yacht Malizia II.”
To offset the carbon emissions created by the flights, the team is paying organizations that use them to finance climate-friendly projects and thus save emissions elsewhere. Schow points out about this ‘solution,’
“This underscores the fact that being climate-friendly is much easier for the wealthy, who can continue to live as they do now and pay other people to help the planet. For the rest of us, we have to uproot our lifestyles to comply with climate policies.”

“This same scenario plays out among celebrities and politicians who take private jets while claiming the world will end if we don’t reduce our climate footprint,” Schow continued. “In January, The Daily Wire’s Emily Zanotti reported that celebrities and activists took more than 1,500 private jets to attend a posh climate change event in Switzerland. Leonardo DiCaprio — one of Hollywood’s biggest proponents of climate change hysteria — continues to use yachts and private jets, as does former Vice President Al Gore. They also have multiple homes and fly far more regularly than the average person, yet they pay others to reduce their carbon emissions so they don’t have to.”
The sixteen-year-old, who is in America to attend the United Nations Climate Action Summit, was named by Time Magazine as a “next-generation leader.”

Apparently, she has more thinking to do before she lectures the world of the environmental destruction caused by those who fly. But she is in high company as she lectures others.
The fact anyone falls for these stunts in this day and age is something I struggle to understand. After all, if climate change is the existential crisis that we are led to believe it is, then why are those who make a career out of shilling it such hypocrites when it comes to their own actions?

As I asked above... are there any actual bona fide Green activists left, or have they all turned Watermelon (i.e. Green on the outside, Red on the inside)?

:shrug:

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

User avatar
Dharmasherab
Posts: 22
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:49 am

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Dharmasherab » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:32 am

Climate change is not a big issue.

If we look at the history of the planet, climate changes have occurred throughout the various prehistoric periods.

Our concern for the environment should not be based on the idea of climate change. Regardless of whether there is climate change or not, we have to care for the environment.

But at the same time not be attached to it either. Because the climate that we have is the result of causes and conditions, and all things which result from causes and conditions are subject to change and impermanence.

If we contemplate the worst case scenario, that humans will fully pollute the Earth and that Earth will reach a point where it can no longer sustain any life, it wont stay that way forever. Then afterwards a new species of organisms will appear and populate the Earth and they to will become extinct just like the billions of different species of organisms that lived and became extinct throughout the various different prehistoric periods and epochs of this planet.

As Buddhists we need to take a more mature view on this. A lot of the climate change activism that is promoted by Buddhists, dont actually come from Buddhism, but instead such individuals show more loyalty to a specific political narrative which they subconsciously keep in higher regard compared to the truths of Buddhism.

Because if we truly kept the Buddhist teachings as the highest and the most precious, then we wont be defiling our minds for something which is meant to change and be subject to impermanence.

Whether climate change happens or not doesnt really matter. It will be the defilement that will remain in our minds trying to get worked up about something which is beyond our control.

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:16 am

SethRich wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:52 pm
Greetings,
The demonstration, scheduled to start at 11:30 am Pacific time on September 20, will mark the first time in Amazon’s 25-year history that workers at its Seattle headquarters have walked off the job, though many are taking paid vacation to do so.
So a small percentage at people at Amazon's head office are synchronizing a day of annual leave to save the world? OK...

:rofl:

What they've not really considered is that organizations actually want their people to utilize their annual leave, for a raft of reasons including personal well-being and to reduce the overall liabilities (i.e. owings) of the company. Maybe next year Amazon will organize the protest themselves in order to trim their staff's annual leave balances? 8-)
The protest is part of a global general strike led by 16-year-old climate change activist Greta Thunberg taking place ahead of the United Nations Climate Action Summit on September 23.
:rofl:

I won't criticize Greta directly, because it's the puppet-master who controls the puppet, but the hypocrisy of these UN-orchestrated stunts that they are roping her into are everything that is wrong with Watermelon activism (i.e. Green on the outside, Red on the inside).
...
As I asked above... are there any actual bona fide Green activists left, or have they all turned Watermelon (i.e. Green on the outside, Red on the inside)?

:shrug:

Metta,
Paul. :)
Okay, it was a stunt. Admitted, granted.

Next topic: watermelons. Oh, and the UN.

I hope you won't mind if I make this personal, Paul, since there's no other way I can argue it coherently without making this post far too long.

You are taking the classic neoliberal position, believing that anything that limits :bow: The Market :bow: limits :bow: Freedom :bow: and is therefore evil and :spy: socialist :spy: or at least a :saucer: socialist conspiracy :saucer: - up to and including any :spy: UN - inspired action limiting the Freedom of any individual country :spy:

Okay, I exaggerate. Admitted, granted. And I apologise.
Feel free to correct my view of your views.

But, meanwhile, you should admit that such a world view makes it somewhat difficult for you to see any communal or collective action as good.
In this post a few days ago viewtopic.php?f=9&t=105&start=80#p9934 I asked you to assess various actions on their merits and you evaded the opportunity. I ask you again to try it.

As for the watermelons: they grow naturally in neoliberally fertilised fields. If anyone left of Ayn Rand is a socialist, then anyone with a social conscience is a socialist.

Okay, I exaggerate - again. :oops:
But not much.

Most of the green activists I know would love to be able to ignore politics but a lot of them (us, since I am one) see no hope of significant changes in key policies with right-wing politicians in power so we align with the left. That is, we are not lefties pretending to be greenies but greenies working with anyone who might help. Trust me, if right-wing politicians did the right thing by the environment, I would vote for them.

:namaste:
Kim

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:28 am

This article is ten years old but, sadly, not at all out of date.
And it makes Franzen's point even more strongly than he does: it's time to admit that we are not going to win the war against climate change, so that we can focus on the more realistic task of minimising its inevitable effects.

But he then adds another argument: that climate change is not the primary cause of our environmental woes. Rather, he says, our whole economic system is responsible and climate change is one of many serious problems which it causes. Therefore, what we should be doing is reforming the system:
...before we can have the slightest chance of meaningful action, having told the truth, we have to face the climate reality, fully and unflinchingly. If we base our planning on false premises — such as the oft-stated stutter that reducing our greenhouse-gas emissions will forestall “the worst effects of global warming” — we can only come up with false solutions. “Solutions” that will make us feel better as we tumble toward the end, but will make no ultimate difference whatsoever.

Furthermore, we can and must pose the problem without necessarily providing the “solutions.”[7] I can’t tell you how many climate activists have scolded me, “You can’t state a problem like that without providing some solutions.” If we accept that premise, all of scientific inquiry as well as many other kinds of problem-solving would come to a screeching halt. The whole point of stating a problem is to clarify questions, confusions, and unknowns, so that the problem statement can be mulled, chewed, and clarified to lead to some meaningful answers, even though the answers may seem to be out of reach.

Some of our most important thinking happens while developing the problem statement, and the better the problem statement the richer our responses. That’s why framing the global warming problem as greenhouse-gas concentrations has proved to be such a dead end.

Here is the problem statement as it is beginning to unfold for me. We are all a part of struggling to develop this thinking together:

We must leave behind 10,000 years of civilization; this may be the hardest collective task we’ve ever faced. It has given us the intoxicating power to create planetary changes in 200 years that under natural cycles require hundreds of thousands or millions of years — but none of the wisdom necessary to keep this Pandora’s Box tightly shut. We have to discover and re-discover other ways of living on earth.

We love our cars, our electricity, our iPods, our theme parks, our bananas, our Nikes, and our nukes, but we behave as if we understand nothing of the land and water and air that gives us life. It is past time to think and act differently.

If we live at all, we will have to figure out how to live locally and sustainably. ...
:reading: https://grist.org/article/2009-08-23-th ... -activism/

It's a longish article but well referenced and well worth reading.

Where I part company with the author is in his implicit belief that we have time to change the system before addressing the most urgent of the problems it has created. It might - just barely - have been true when he wrote it, but it isn't now. Our timeframe for escaping climate catastrophe is now on the order of ten years. If we haven't cut global emissions by 50% before 2030 (both of those are ballpark figures) we will have so many other problems that the system will likely collapse. That's not the kind of transition he's talking about.

:namaste:
Kim

User avatar
SethRich
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by SethRich » Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:40 am

Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:28 am
Our timeframe for escaping climate catastrophe is now on the order of ten years. If we haven't cut global emissions by 50% before 2030 (both of those are ballpark figures) we will have so many other problems that the system will likely collapse.
That's all very dramatic.

:console:

I'm just wondering whether you've seen this brief 5-minute video and the group dynamics it describes?... Richard Lindzen discusses the climate change debate on Prager University

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:43 am

SethRich wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:40 am
Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:28 am
Our timeframe for escaping climate catastrophe is now on the order of ten years. If we haven't cut global emissions by 50% before 2030 (both of those are ballpark figures) we will have so many other problems that the system will likely collapse.
That's all very dramatic.

:console:
Yes, and since you're still relatively young you can expect to have to deal with it for most of the rest of your life.
:console:
I'm just wondering whether you've seen this brief 5-minute video and the group dynamics it describes?... Richard Lindzen discusses the climate change debate on Prager University

:candle:
Lindzen has got form. Lindzen has got skin in the game. https://www.desmogblog.com/richard-lindzen
Lindzen is not a climate scientist, so I wouldn't trust his climate science even if he wasn't in the pay of those who benefit from denialism.
Lindzen is not a psychologist, sociologist, or any other kind of behavioural scientist, so I wouldn't trust his social science even if he wasn't in the pay of those who benefit from denialism.
So ... in answer to your question: no.

:namaste:
Kim

User avatar
SethRich
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by SethRich » Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:31 am

Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:43 am
I wouldn't trust his climate science even if he wasn't in the pay of those who benefit from denialism.
Yet you clamor fervently onto anything produced by those "in the pay of those who benefit from" climate alarmism, including the UN, the EU, The Guardian, ABC, CNN, New York Times, Washington Post, socialists, globalists, Watermelon activists, proponents of "big government" et. al.

How do you mentally reconcile this one-sided, restricted and imbalanced approach to sourcing materials pertaining to the climate, when "it is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it" (Aristotle)?
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:43 am
Yes, and since you're still relatively young you can expect to have to deal with it for most of the rest of your life.
:console:
Thank you for the concern, but I have zero concerns about CO2 related climate-change and therefore zero dukkha arising due to fears and panic pertaining to it. Life is good and I have a big bonfire planned on the 28th September to celebrate it. Let me know if you're in the neighbourhood...
:toast:
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:43 am
So ... in answer to your question: no.
No, [1] you've not watched it, [2] won't bother to watch it, or [3] you disagree with what he says.

:?:

Kind regards.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:56 am

SethRich wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:31 am
Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:43 am
I wouldn't trust his climate science even if he wasn't in the pay of those who benefit from denialism.
Yet you clamor fervently onto anything produced by those "in the pay of those who benefit from" climate alarmism, including the UN, the EU, The Guardian, ABC, CNN, New York Times, Washington Post, socialists, globalists, Watermelon activists, proponents of "big government" et. al.
Huh?
:crazy:

Oh, that's right - everyone left of Ayn Rand is a Socialist. I forgot.
How do you mentally reconcile this one-sided, restricted and imbalanced approach to sourcing materials pertaining to the climate, when "it is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it" (Aristotle)?
Easy: I have read more than enough denialist bullshit and I don't need any more any time soon.
If you don't think that's reasonable, you have far more free time in your life than I have in mine.
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:43 am
So ... in answer to your question: no.
No, [1] you've not watched it, [2] won't bother to watch it, or [3] you disagree with what he says.

:?:
Probably all of the above. I'm just not quite sure that [3] is 100% true, since even a stopped clock is correct twice in every 24 hours.

:coffee:
Kim

User avatar
SethRich
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by SethRich » Mon Sep 16, 2019 9:11 pm

Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:56 am
Easy: I have read more than enough denialist bullshit and I don't need any more any time soon.
Interesting how you think you what it is, when you've not bothered to watch it.

What it actually is, is a video about this very topic - climate change, politics and activism.

Either way, thank you for sharing with us the internal thought processes and filtering that you adopt in order to curate and sustain the structural integrity of your self-styled echo chamber.
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:56 am
If you don't think that's reasonable, you have far more free time in your life than I have in mine.
Interesting how you have more than 5 minutes to protest why you cannot watch a 5 minute video.

Kind regards.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

User avatar
Kim O'Hara
Posts: 1137
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:07 am
Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Climate change - politics and activism

Post by Kim O'Hara » Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:39 pm

More grist for your mill, Paul:
The gloves are off: 'predatory' climate deniers are a threat to our children

In this age of rapidly melting glaciers, terrifying megafires and ever more puissant hurricanes, of acidifying and rising oceans, it is hard to believe that any further prod to climate action is needed.

But the reality is that we continue to live in a business-as-usual world. Our media is filled with enthusiastic announcements about new fossil fuel projects, or the unveiling of the latest fossil-fuelled supercar, as if there's no relationship between such things and climate change.

In Australia, the disconnect among our political leaders on the deadly nature of fossil fuels is particularly breathtaking.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison continues to sing the praises of coal, while members of the government call for subsidies for coal-fired power plants. A few days ago, Energy and Emissions Reduction Minister Angus Taylor urged that the nation's old and polluting coal-fired power plants be allowed to run "at full tilt".

In the past, many of us have tolerated such pronouncements as the utterings of idiots — in the true, original Greek meaning of the word as one interested only in their own business. But the climate crisis has now grown so severe that the actions of the denialists have turned predatory: they are now an immediate threat to our children. ...

Words have not cut through. Is rebellion the only option?

Not yet a year old, Extinction Rebellion has had an enormous impact. In April it shut down six critical locations in London, overwhelmed the police and justice system with 1,000 arrests, and forced the British government to become the first nation ever to declare a climate emergency.

So unstable is our current societal response that a single young woman, Greta Thunberg, has been able to spark a profoundly powerful global movement. Less than a year ago she went on a one-person school strike. Today school strikes for climate action are a global phenomenon. ...
:reading: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-17/ ... n/11518138

:coffee:
Kim

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Dhammanando and 12 guests