Can you afford to go green if you're poor?

Applying the Dharma for the preservation of planet Earth and its inhabitants
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Kim O'Hara
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Can you afford to go green if you're poor?

Post by Kim O'Hara » Wed Sep 04, 2019 10:39 pm

This is an American narrative from someone trying to do the right thing on very little money.
Politicians and corporations have placed the burden of environmental responsibility on the consumer – but how easy is it to go green when you’re barely getting by? How easy is it to go green, to make deliberate, eco-friendly choices when you’re barely getting by? Can you be green and poor, as I am?

I live in an environmentally conscious place: a rural town with thriving local food businesses, a farmers’ market and many organic farms. But it’s also a small town in central Appalachia, in the poorest county in my state: Ohio. Many people here go hungry. They can’t afford food, let alone organic food. A gas station is the closest source of “groceries” for some people without cars. You can’t walk everywhere if you live in the country.

For a week, I kept a diary with some of the choices I made toward being green. ...
:reading: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... cost-diary

The best point she makes is one that doesn't apply only to people on limited incomes:
It’s overwhelming to think the burden of keeping the world alive rests on the shoulders of consumers. And frankly, it shouldn’t.
:thinking:
Kim

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SethRich
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Re: Can you afford to go green if you're poor?

Post by SethRich » Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:34 pm

Greetings,

Lately I've noticed a lot of abandoned shopping trolleys in my neighbourhood.

I suspect that these trolleys were taken off-site by people who begrudge having to pay 15c a pop for plastic bags (courtesy of the state government's ban on 'single use' plastic bags), when they're already struggling to make ends meet. So, instead of carrying home a few plastic bags full of supplies... they wheel their entire shop home, and dump the trolley afterwards.

Interestingly, a lot of these trolleys have attached baby seats (for babies who cannot yet sit upright), suggesting it's people who are struggling financially due (in part at least) to the burdens of rearing children. I also suspect that such people now need to buy plastic bags to use as bin liners, to use as nappy sacks, and in order to pick up and dispose of pet excrement.

I may be wrong about what's happening here, but I'm struggling to find a better theory for this phenomenon.

In short, socialist state interference disempowers people from making what they consider to be the "best choices" - whether that's what's best for themselves, for others, or for the environment. Not only are they disempowered, but regulations invariably have negative consequences that those who draft them are either blind to, or care to ignore because they provide golden opportunities for virtue signalling and espousing green/socialist propaganda.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

"Our civilization is at the point where we need to start discerning between 'Progression' & 'Regression'." (Kabamur)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

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Kim O'Hara
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Re: Can you afford to go green if you're poor?

Post by Kim O'Hara » Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:50 pm

SethRich wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:34 pm
Greetings,

Lately I've noticed a lot of abandoned shopping trolleys in my neighbourhood.

... In short, socialist state interference disempowers people ...
Hi, Paul,
Last time I looked, Melbourne and the state of Victoria around it were as capitalist as the rest of Australia, although not as capitalist as our Dear Leader (oops, can't call him that because that would make him communist, and that would mortify him) ... as our neoliberal Pentecostalist Prime Minister would like. Have you moved to Cuba without telling us, or are you just using "socialist" as an equivalent of "unjustifiable" ?

:coffee:
Kim

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SethRich
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Re: Can you afford to go green if you're poor?

Post by SethRich » Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:17 am

Greetings Kim,
Kim O'Hara wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:50 pm
Last time I looked, Melbourne and the state of Victoria around it were as capitalist as the rest of Australia...
Premier Daniel Andrews is from the "Socialist Left" faction of the left-wing Victorian Labor Party. (source)

Image

Do you wish to deviate any further from your OP?

Kind regards.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

"Our civilization is at the point where we need to start discerning between 'Progression' & 'Regression'." (Kabamur)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

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Kim O'Hara
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Location: Tropical Queensland, Australia

Re: Can you afford to go green if you're poor?

Post by Kim O'Hara » Fri Sep 06, 2019 4:35 am

Not right now. :smile:

:coffee:
Kim

:focus:

Cittasanto
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Re: Can you afford to go green if you're poor?

Post by Cittasanto » Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:25 pm

Hi Kim,
I agree the burden shouldn't be on the consumer. However the consumer is also the market force... And governments get their money from the consumers... So the consumer bares the fount of limited choice. And the consumer complains about taxes, and prices as it stands. So when the money is going to infrastructure upkeep, cost of wages and the rest... It may difficult for companies to run so they have a viable future.
Bare in mind a wind turbine cost about $2-3m each, and the difficulties there are in finding and installing these from planning to local complaints and upkeep.
I recently came across this study which shows people are more willing to fork out a small amount per month $10, but as the cost to them goes up ($50) the willingness goes down. http://filesforprogress.org/datasets/wa ... sil_fuels/
It ultimately falls to the general population to pay for these things in taxes or utility bills, and profits are only what is left offer running costs, and can go toward future expenses (such as lower income, or newer safer greener supply)....
People want everything. Free university, greener energy, the latest gadgets, at lower cost... But they don't want to pay for it in taxes... Or they don't want the tax payers elected representatives to have a say in what they want every tax payer to pay for.
We can not have it every way we want/like and we have to do something or compromise somewhere to get closer to what we want.

Kind regards
Cittasanto

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