73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

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fwiw
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73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by fwiw » Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:08 pm

Here is the poll:
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fox-ne ... r-6-8-2019

On twitter, journalist Glenn Greenwald comments:
Amazing: this new Fox poll shows the groups that most trust the CIA - THE CIA! - are liberals, Democrats & Clinton voters. 77% of Dems trust the CIA; only 22% don't. 64% of liberals trust CIA; 22% don't. This is the enduring sickness of Russiagate/MSNBC
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Although I believe Greenwald misread the numbers. It shows 73-23% for Dems (unless he counts "don't know" as a yes, which is arguable since the absence of opinion can be considered a de facto an endorsement of the status quo). For liberals, it's 74-21% (it seems he misread 74 for 64, an error which weakens his point, therefore probably not intentional).


Journalist Matt Taibbi provides some reminder/context:
he CIA engages in drone assassination, rendition, torture, indefinite detention, and warrantless surveillance, in addition to a long history overturning democratic governments.
In USA, I used to think the brainwashing was strongest among right-wingers, but it is now clear center-leftists are not falling very far behind.
... in my opinion

justsit
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Re: 73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by justsit » Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:42 pm

Any time I see results of a "poll" or "study" of any type, my first response is to check the source. Who paid for the poll/study, what were the statistical methods used, what was the sample size and how were the participants selected, who benefits from a particular conclusion, etc., etc. - all will have significant impact on the results. Implicit (or even explicit) bias is a problem with polling of all types, not just one political group.

It's not surprising that a Fox poll finds results that support their own agenda. A sample size of 1003 and then project the results onto the whole population? Nope. I'd take the conclusions with a large grain of salt.

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fwiw
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Re: 73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by fwiw » Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:14 pm

I think this is appropriate criticism, although I would draw a conclusion I perceive as more moderate, for the following reasons:

- I have seen Fox News publish polls that seem to contradict their "agenda", for example showing Sanders as more popular/trustworthy than Trump

- Is there a particular reason to think that this poll favors Fox New's "agenda"?

Maybe I am wrong to assume that there might be a single truthful thing coming out of Fox News, but the alternative strikes me as an extreme assumption.
... in my opinion

justsit
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Re: 73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by justsit » Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:33 pm

My experience with Fox News is pretty minimal, as I don't own a television and only see it while in waiting rooms, etc., but the tenor of the broadcasts seems quite skewed, IMO. My evaluation of that media outlet is based on that of the Media Bias/Fact Check website, which I have found to be generally accurate. Here's their summary for Fox https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/fox-news/.

I agree that Fox in all likelihood can and perhaps does air/promote some truthful content, but my objection is that the particular study cited in your post is very poorly designed with results of dubious validity. Thus any discussion based on that study has little or no real usefulness.

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fwiw
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Re: 73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by fwiw » Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:23 pm

justsit wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:33 pm
My experience with Fox News is pretty minimal, as I don't own a television and only see it while in waiting rooms, etc., but the tenor of the broadcasts seems quite skewed, IMO. My evaluation of that media outlet is based on that of the Media Bias/Fact Check website, which I have found to be generally accurate. Here's their summary for Fox https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/fox-news/.
I agree Fox is rarely a honest actor.
my objection is that the particular study cited in your post is very poorly designed with results of dubious validity. Thus any discussion based on that study has little or no real usefulness.
Well then let's discuss why you come to the conclusion that the study is "poorly designed". Here is what the poll mentions under 'Methodology':
Interviews were conducted October 6-8, 2019 among a random national sample of 1,003 registered voters (RV). Landline (229) and cellphone (774) telephone numbers were randomly selected for inclusion in the survey using a probability proportionate to size method, which means phone numbers for each state are proportional to the number of voters in each state. Results based on the full sample have a margin of sampling error of ± 3 percentage points. The Fox News Poll is conducted under the joint direction of Beacon Research (D) (formerly known as Anderson Robbins Research) and Shaw & Company Research (R).

Fieldwork conducted by Braun Research, Inc. of Princeton, NJ.
It seems to me that a sample size of 1,000 is fairly common practice. It only polls registered voters, not the American public at large, but that is hardly something we can hold against them given the type of data sought for.
... in my opinion

justsit
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Re: 73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by justsit » Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:33 pm

You're right, actually it isn't a study, it's a poll. Personally, I think political polling as it is practiced in the US is pretty meaningless across the board. This is my just my opinion based on what I learned in political science and research methodology courses in college.

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SethRich
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Re: 73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by SethRich » Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:32 am

Greetings,

With Fox, consider that it's now:

- Owned by Disney (effective March 2019)
- Got RINO Paul Ryan on the board

These factors have the potential to lead to outcomes not necessary aligned to the traditional "Murdochracy". Dare I say it, but the two influences above would be pro-establishment and pro-deep-state, hence pro-CIA. In terms of popularity amongst conservative viewers, the likes of Sean Hannity and Tucker Carlson are as popular as ever, but OANN and Fox Business Channel are likely nibbling away at the overall Fox News viewership.

Just as CNN has not remained a static constant over time, it would be a mistake to regard Fox as a perpetually stable, monolithic entity.

:candle:
"Let us neither be perpetrators nor victims!" (DN26)

:candle: "...his name was Seth Rich..."

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fwiw
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Re: 73% of US Democrat voters trust the CIA (Fox News poll)

Post by fwiw » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:31 am

Here is some interesting context about the CIA by Trump's secretary of state Mike Pompeo


... in my opinion

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